Low Contrast and Green Cast

[Craig Wills]

Hello,
I just purchased my S2 and when I open the images in photoshop, They are quite flat and green looking. I can use the Auto Levels and the images are effectively corrected but I am currious if this is normal. I have tried different WB settings and can see a change but not in the direction I want it to. I have increased the exposure compensation to a +1 to try and increase the exposure but images are still very flat. I have a PC running photoshop 5.5. Any ideas? Thank You.

[Andre]

Can you post a sample?

Originally posted by Craig Wills

[Craig Wills]

This is a sample of a copy I shot of a designer board shot with studio strobes. The only light in the room was the strobes themself that I use to copy to transparency film with no problem. Let me know what you think.

[Craig Wills]

This image was shot outdoors using available sunlight. Camera was set to auto WB and exposure compesation set to 0. 100 iso setting.

[Andre]

The indoor image definitely looks green. The outdoor one looks good to me.
Is it just when you use Photoshop? What if you view them in another package?

[Craig Wills]

I agree the outdoor looks better but it still seems a little low in contrast and leans slightly to the yellow green side. I have not tried openingin anything but Photoshop. I am really confused as to why the studio strobes produce such a flat green image. Thanks for your reply. So the outdoor looks normal to you? The LCD display on the back of the camera looks much better than in the computer.
Thanks again.

[justinb]

Your first picture does have a definite green cast on my monitor, but the second does not at all. Have you tried prints of either of these two shots to find out if the cast is any different in the the final output rather than what you see on the screen? I don't know how your monitor is calibrated, but it might be worth a shot.

My S1 was much worse than the S2 regarding red and green color casts on indoor shots, especially when mixing incandescent and flash lighting, but even the auto white balance on the S2 gets confused once in a while.

WB control may be one of the few things that are appreciably better on the D100 than the S2, since you have the ability to alter the existing profiles. I never have figured out why, but the Auto WB on the Fuji's that I have owned has always been a little more hit and miss...even compared to the P&S digitals that I have used.

Justin

[Michael]

Hi Guys,
I can absolutly see your problem becasue I have exactly the same results from my S2 Pro. From day one I noticed that the pictures I took were dull with a green cast but I thought it had to be just the way Exif was presenting them. Then I applied PhotoShop Elements to 'Enhance / Auto Levels' and the pictures magically correct most times- that slightly greenish underexposed cast that drops away when you apply Photoshop.

Most every time you hit Enhance Auto Levels there is a direct and dramatic improvement. However some photographs remain very slightly altered, maybe one in 50 or so. Therefore it is not entirely consistent, or perhaps Auto Levels finds it difficult to spot the issue.

The Camera settings I have been using are as follows Auto WB, HIGH Colour, STD Tone, STD S. Incidentally the manual is very poor covering off the difference on these aspects and any additional information would be very much appreciated.

I am very disapointed with these results. I am aware that you can resett the white balance but I feel the expectation should be that I can take the S2 Pro out of the box and it should take a photograph with a white balance and exposure tht should equal a camera 1/10 of its price.

I very much appreciate any help that can be lended to this as I am considering returning the camera. I am attaching a shot to show the difference. This is not a particularly great example, just one I have to hand. Once you see it you notice it a lot more. Intrestingly the photographs in the LCD are absolutly perfecct as descried above.

All help gratefully appreciated
:confused:

[Craig Wills]

I have since found a solution to the problem. To use the auto white balance mode seems to be useless. I set up a new white balance with the custom white balance setting. Using cus.1, I set up a white balance with a white card, shot outside on a bright sunny day in direct sunlight. Worked great. The cus.2, I set up a copy stand shot with the same white piece of paper and used strobes. That as well worked great. In both settings, as I setup the white balance, I used the exposure compesation set at +.5 to give a little more exposure. Once the custom white balance was saved, I turned the exposure compensation back to 0.0 and my exposures have been right on. I think a slightly off white piece of paper would have created a slightly cooler profile to put the colors more in tune to what I would prefer, but the white is much better than the standard auto WB. Knowing color temps. and what to do when shooting daylight film under different lighting conditions, I don't even use the other WB's. I just use my new Cus.1 and Cus.2 WB's. I hope that helps. Remeber to register your new custom WB to save it or it won't work.

[davealan]

I used to have color cast problems. I then saw a post on the Wallace ExpoDisk:

http://www.expodisc.com/

I have one now and always set a custom WB by shooting directly into the sun right before I go into the day’s shoot. That way, I am setting the WB exactly per the lighting as it exists at that time. It acts like a “gray card filter” - much easier than trying to shoot a white card.

If the lighting changes - shoot another custom WB and you’re dead on again. Always shoot a custom WB just before shooting in new lighting conditions.

I now just set black and white levels in PhotoShop or do a little levels/curves correction. Very rarely do I play with color correction. I don’t even use iCorrect anymore.

Another nice benefit I came across - a very good “warming filter” effect. Set the WB when the sun is high in the sky. When the sun is setting and nearer the horizon, there is a natural warming color effect. With the custom WB still set at the “high noon” setting, the warm colors come through and are not “corrected” by any auto WB.

I have also corrected fluorescent light by shooting directly into the light source and flashes by setting a WB off the strobes fired at full output. When I then shoot a frame through the ExpoDisk (again, it acts as a “gray card filter”) and take it into PhotoShop, I get very good neutral grays as measured with the sample tool.

Dave

[Michael]

Hi Craig, Dave,
Many thanks for responding with your excellent advice. I have tried your suggestion Craig and felt certain you offered the perfect solution. Equally Alan ExpoDisk looks like a very good product and I have the credit card out already.

However to my complete surprise resetting the white balance has not resolved my problem, nor hence will the Expo Disk be of use if the issue is not solved by recalibration. The perverse green cast remains, although the exposure seems slightly better. Here is what I have tried and found.

I re-set the white balance as specified in the manual. This was set at 11:30 am in bright sunshine on a pure white card. Equally I added half a stop as suggested to compensate for the underexposure. Once saved in cus.1 I spent a couple of days testing. In addition to this custom setting I tried sunlight settings and cloudy settings on the camera as the circumstances presented themselves. All unfortunately had the slight green cast once again and all were slightly underexposed except for cus.1. Also, when ever the shots are taken under a glass roof, I noticed the green cast is amplified to overwhelm the image.

Please find attached photographs for a sample to explain the difference. I appreciate that it is difficult to see this properly on the screen, but if anyone would like to see the original and then place them into PhotoShop to see the AutoLevel difference please feel free and I will send you the samples so that the difference is clear.

I am open for any suggestions at this stage? All help much appreciated.

Photo 1 cavalry officer, look at the black horses, and see the cast. This was shot at cus1. I appreciate it is hard to notice it individually first, but when you see it in it is more than overwhelming.

[Michael]

Now see it with PhotShop E£nhance AutoLevels (that only manages to save 50% of the shots) :rolleyes:

[Michael]

Once again, straight out of the camera, and incidentaly I have tred shooting TIF and JPG to see if the problems lay in the compression to no avail - ie the green case is there in all cases.

[Michael]

For some reason the phot did not upload, attempt no 2.

[Michael]

Hi Guys,
Looks like the site only allows two images at a time.
I guess the issues is more than evident in the above sample?
Appreciate any help that can be provided as right now my feelings are the camera is sadly not fit for the purpose it was intended.
Kind regards
Michael

[Michael]

Well, it looks like it just did not like the previous image. This is what the photgraph should have looked like rescued by PhotoShop

[Michael]

Skin tones shot with cus1 once again under glass

[Michael]

tweeked by PhotoShop to look like what it should have been.

[Michael]

Fianlly once agian under glass where it all goes green (afternoon sun)

[Michael]

Corrected

[davealan]

There is always a chance of a camera hardware problem. As far as the ExpoDisk goes, it’s expensive if it is only used for troubleshooting, but may be and end to a problem if it is used continually.

I too had a yellowish or greenish color cast on all my photos. To troubleshoot my situation using ExpoDisk, I set a custom WB shooting a tungsten bulb and a fluorescent light (two separate tests). I then shot a frame through the ExpoDisk at the same light source I just set the custom white balance to. Photoshop showed a very neutral gray, RGB always within a couple of points of each other - well within the consistency of the sensor itself, I believe.

I never found the source of the cast - not to say that the pursuit of the source is not a worthy endeavor - but the expodisk fixed it so well, I no longer worry about it.

It may be a solution.

Dave

[Craig Wills]

Michael,
I would continue to play with your custom white balance. Try creating your custom white balance with a pure white card and expose with a strobe or flash unit. When I frist did this, I forgot to register the setting after I shot the image. Also remember the custom white balance does nothing to the auto WB and the other WB's. Only the Cus. 1 or Cus. 2 are effected. If you shoot with any of the other settings, they will not be adjusted to your new setting. I believe if you shoot in raw mode, the camera reverts back to and doesn't take advantage of the new setting as well.
The shot of yours under the glass is probably a result of the pains of glass changing the color temperature of the daylight coming through the ceiling. In that situation, you may want to do another WB for that particular situation to balance for that light source.
Here is an image I shot recently that has had no photoshop work done to it. I am sure some may have problems with it, but I am happy with the way the camera is shooting now. This was shot with Cus. 1.

[Michael]

Hi Guys,
Many thanks again for your responses and advice. The Expo Disk is on order not just for the calibration but as a useful addition to any digital camera bag. As the resetting of the white balance did not work I doubt however that it will do the trick as in effect this is the area it operates and simplifies. However I will of course try it and hope for the best.

Craig I am aware that the cus.1 & 2 are the only setting that the White Balance adjusts. I just thought I would go through all of the presets once I was testing to see if the camera produced the cast against all pre settings. Equally I am very much aware that the colour imbalance could be caused by the glass, but equally the light dif not give that colour to the naked eye nor would any camera to my experience get the colours so wildly wrong.

Running out of any other options I believe the next step is to take this issue to Fuji and see what fix the can bring to the situation. I will keep you posted as to the outcome. Standby.
:confused:

[TrevorPierce]

Michael,

I'm also having problems like you're having. Not so much with green, but a flat image like you showed in the first image.

Do you notice a difference when you are shooting with a flash? I seem to have better luck with exposure and color if I use the flash.

I'd like to resolve the problem also, shouldn't have to fix everything in PS.

Thanks
Trevor

[Michael]

Hi Guys,
My last course of action was to go back to Fuji and work the problem. I am afraid I did not follow through on that.

I had been to Fuji before hand and I was disappointed with their lack of interest. Their response was basically; work with the white balance and exposure compensation, read the manual.

Personally I felt they were not interested. I appreciate mails can often appear colder than the writer intended, but when it came to the crunch my instinct told me they were going to be hard to motivate to take an interest.

Also any magazine review that showed pictures from Fuji S2 Pro, I noticed, to my eye, all had that green cast attached. I was beginning to feel it might be endemic and very difficult for them to resolve.

Finally my personal instinct was you should be able to take this camera out of the box and produce something that equates to a shot from a $200 camera, and I should not be doing all of this chasing about to resolve a Fuji issue.

Hence it was just too easy for me to put the S2 Pro on the on the shop counter and say ‘’love the camera to bits but wholeheartedly disillusioned with the pictures’’. One look at the output, plus my file of woe and the shop assistance said ‘’that will not be a problem sir’.

So I said goodbye to my beloved S2 pro and with a heavy heart I decide to try Digital SLR romance once more. The Nikon F100.

Guys it is far too early to give you a verdict as I have only had it out for a few hours over the weekend. However the green cast has absolutely disappeared immediately.

Enhance Auto Levels made a dramatic impact 9 / 10 times on the S2 Pro, even if it did not resolve every issue. With the Nikon I have to say it so far has got it right most every time and Enhance auto levels only slightly enhances maybe 2 / 10 shots. Hence my green cast has gone away by that one action on the sales counter.

As I say it is early days and I need to spend more time with the camera in challenging circumstances. However initial impressions bode very well and it has a host of things I find very endearing to it that may overcome my S2 Pro first Lover bias and ultimate disappointment. I feel I might be on to a winner!

Do you want me to keep you posted?
:D

[Michael]

Hi Trevour,
Colour balance is 90% better with Nikon. I agree the S2 gave very nice skin tones with flash equally. And funny enough the flash on the Nikon gives cooler skin tones. however this can be altered by another setting that I have not done the dentistry on yet!

However the fix was certainly the D100, absolutly. I have to say that I do love the power handling and it feels apart form that nice big file size a better allround camera.

Thats my bit!