B&W Metemerism / Suggestions??

[HulaMike]

Originally posted under B&W pics.

I'm having problems trying to print a decent B&W print on an Epson 1280.

My biggest problem is trying to get a dense black on my 1280. I'm using a calibrated monitor and a good ICC profile from Jon Cone for Epson ink on Epson semigloss paper that produces flawless color prints but l'm getting some latent red and an overall greenish metemerism in the 1280 B&W print. Desaturating and reducing the file to greyscale hasn't helped at all. Short of changing one of my 1280's to a quad tone B&W printer, any suggestions?

PS: I can't seem to upload the image again but it's located under B&W pics, "3 men / 3 waves".

Original file was shot RAW, org, org, off set to B&W in EX converter. It's impossible to see on screen but there is a pink cast throughout the misty sky and a decided red cast to the sand dune upper left once printed out.

[bjnicholls]

Printing "black and white" via a color printer is difficult. First, the blacks inks aren't neutral, so limiting the printer to black only via the driver will produce images with the cool black that the 1280 dye based inks produces (it has a cyan component and can fade just like the cyan inks). The black only print mode has a coarse texture since the grey tones are generated only by varying the dot size and density as opposed to mixing colors to produce greys in RGB mode.

Epson came out with Gray Balancer software for the 2100 printer. With it, you can compensate for color cast and get a quite neutral print. The software isn't very well designed and Epson USA didn't include if with the 2200 - the US market equivalent of the 2100. There isn't anything like the Gray Balancer for other photo printers that I'm aware of.

Other than looking for profiles that will deliver better neutrals, you're probably not going to get a really good neutral print from the 1280. If you'll be doing a lot of black and white images, I'd suggest looking into getting a printer to use with hextone (monochromatic) inks. These inks come in sets with black and shades of gray instead of colors. The prints come out neutral, but you can't do any color tinting of your images either. Instead, you have to choose from cool, neutral or warm inks to use in your dedicated printer. You could get a refurbished or used printer to keep the investment low. Canon has released a black and white inkjet printer - another option, but I'm not sure about the ink longevity compared to the hextone/quadtone ink sets.

[HulaMike]

Thanks BJ. I have read forever about trying to achieve good B&W with older Epsons and the greenish toned metemerism that occurs. Short of a hextone ink set I guess I could farm out specific printing jobs as required.

Any guess as to why 90% of this file prints fairly well as a B&W and why only certain parts have a color cast? Shouldn't the problem be across the gamut of the entire image? That I don't understand. Perhaps after I experiment some more with adjusting the file as a LAB file I'll get a better result. It is a puzzler though why only specific parts of this image print with a reddish tone and not others.

[High ISO!]

Hi Mike,
GREAT to see you back again!

I don't regularly print B/W on any of my printers. But when I have tried, I have gotten the same ugly results. Moreso on the 1280, than on my Dye Sub.

I can't tell you why...I only know it's very frustrating!!!!:mad:

I actually got the P400, because I was really having trouble getting even black & dark browns on the 1280, in color. The P400 saved me, I can print any colored dog now with no trouble!:cool:

I do find a slight cyan cast to B/W images off the P400 though, but the image seems to have better tone overall on this printer.

Alissa

[crabby]

Hey Hula!

try this:
Printing from Photoshop, in the print preview window under color management, select your source space profile. Adobe (1998) or sRGB which ever camp your in.
Select "Generic Gray Profile" for your print space profile.
Then hit print

[crabby]

Then in the print window under Print Settings: select your print media.
Select black ink only.
Select your Mode how ever you like.
After your done with Print Settings go to Color Management in your print window.

[crabby]

In the Color Management window you don't have many options, but you can select your Gamma.
I usually use 2.2
And thats it. Hit print.

[crabby]

I know this setup defies logic but it has produced decent results for me. A friend who doesn't believe in color management showed me this method to end an arguement. BJNicholls is right on the money once again but apparently selecting the generic gray profile does something. The prints are the most neutral that I have produced with a 1270/80. Still not as good as a print from a 2200 and no where near a dedicated monotone ink printer. That same friend of mine now prints Bowhaus mono inks on a 2200 that blows away anything I've ever produced in the darkroom. He found the Cone inks clogged too much.

One other thing. In PSCS I haven't had the chance to try any of these out. Looks like they could lead to something interesting.

[HulaMike]

Thanks Mike. I have been using a Cone ICC profile as both the image color space source for print set up. Works very well with color imges but not B&W. I'll try your suggestions right away.

Thanks again.

[jeffinkansas]

black only ink printing has produced the best for me

[dartz]

i envy this, i wish i could have this for my i9100...

http://www.piezography.com/products.html

[HulaMike]

Thanks Dartz. I have looked at setting up one of my older 1270's with a quad tone set of inks. Currently using it for sublimation printing however.....so it goes.

[Dieselfuel]

Mike,

If you don't want to spend a lot of money, buy an HP 7660 and install ONLY the 59 grey cart.

The prints are STUNNING!

A SLIGHT warm tone, which I love since I'm a portrait photographer.

I bought mine last week for $150. Today, I see my local Best Buy
had them on "clearance" for $120.


I use the Premium Plus glossy and matte HP photo paper (11.5 mils thick).

Cost is around $2.00 per 8x10.

Only problem (maybe) is the largest paper size is 8.5 x 11".

Good luck which ever way you decide to go.