"HARD" Sharpening

[ballroom_boy]

Hi Everyone,

I was reading on another website a posting where someone stated they set "in camera sharpening" to "HARD" for most/all of their photos (they shoot mostly JPG's and like to use the S2 most of the time as a P & S camera). To my surprise, a lot people liked the extra sharpening.

I suspect it is a matter of personal taste - I was curious, how many of you have used this setting and what are your thoughts/opinions on it?

Thanks
Roel :)

[SSonnentag]

I use hard sharpening most of the time. I use 6MP fine JPEG for most P&S shots. I find this saves me from having to sharpen in PS.

Another question..... Are the tone, color and sharpness settings ignored when in RAW mode?

Shawn

[ballroom_boy]

When shooting in RAW mode, none of the camera settings are applied to the file (from what I understand). Rather, all the selected camera settings are written to the RAW file as a set of "default" instructions for converting it to an image readable in the file converter, etc. These instructions can be altered at the time of import. That's one of the several advantages of shooting in the RAW mode.

Cheers
Roel :)

[Roadking8]

I agree the hard setting is very useful but you have to be careful in some shots. Until I can rig a side flash and/or tame the onboard one (I have it set at -3 now). I have to watch my distancing to control the amount of flash to avoid some blown out areas. I did a test with all the settings one at a time to get a handle on each. Then I tried a number (but not all) combinations. In the long run, I don't think there is an easy answer. You camera's CCD may have it's own personality. For now, I prefer STD all across and watch my shooting more. No doubt, I spend more time in PS though.

Does anyone know of an official S2 onboard flash filter or something I can rig to soften the dead-on light when I have to get closer to subject?

Road

[bjnicholls]

I don't get why some S2 users would invest so much in a highly capable DSLR body and then use it as a point and shoot. I won't go into RAW file soapbox mode, but...

But even if you are more casual about image quality, I really can't see the wisdom of using hard sharpening out of the camera. I'd keep the sharpening off and do the final sharpening in Photoshop where you can see what you're doing to the image. Okay, what harm would hard sharpening do to a quickie jpeg for an ebay auction? For throwaway images, not much harm. But how much S2 shooting is done at this level?

Given that you can't even judge exposure from the LCD display, why risk compromising an otherwise nice image by too much sharpening? Of course, even if you zoom in on the LCD to see image details, the file's written and the damage is done. I suppose if you know that your images aren't worthy of an appropriate amount of sharpening, then you're not risking much. You could at least allow for an accidental great image.

If there's even an outside chance that you're going to get a nice photo, do remember that over-sharpening can't be undone. There is no canned sharpening value that is right for every image and you certainly won't find the best sharpening with the meager 2 choices the camera offers.


On the "dangers" of RAW files:

In the EX converter you have the option of using all the camera settings at the time of the shot or you can override any setting individually while keeping as many of the camera settings as you like. No danger at all. Quite the contrary. You can fix settings that you made in error and you can even hand the file off to Photoshop where you can do the image tuning with precision.


The only "official" flash diffuser for the onboard speedlight I know of is the SG-2 that comes with the Nikon SU-4 wireless TTL module:

http://www.nikonians.org/dcforum/User_files/3e2dc1a911025ade.gif

http://www.nikonians.org/dcforum/DCForumID7/848.html

[Roadking8]

bknichols...all good, valid points. One of the things I have learned as a photographer (digital or film) is that I have a responsibility to capture the best image I can. I love digital for it's immediancy, it's convenience, and it's flexibility. The down side is that there is almost too much you can do. My approach is to shoot a digital like a film camera concentrating on the exposure, speed, lighting etc. Then I take it a further at the computer and that requires more work and time. I think it is so true...digital is as much about what you can undo as it is what you can do.

Thanks for the onboard flash info. and pic. Looks weird (not your fault). I will continue flash-related discussions under the
"flash" category.

Road

[Swampy]

Originally posted by Roadking8
Does anyone know of an official S2 onboard flash filter or something I can rig to soften the dead-on light when I have to get closer to subject?

Road

I don't know of an official one...buuut...I'm an improvisor. Ever try cutting a small piece of woman's nylons and slipping it over the flash? You could probably achieve the equivelant of levels by choosing "Skin", "Black", etc. :) Just a thought that I may try soon and believe it would work.

I've had a similar problem with my CD Mavica and found that using a small strip of paper across it (not blocking the whole flash, and keeping it even) did the trick for me. Paper worked evenly, where using the nylons would be harder since it would be dependant on how tight it's streched across the flash.

Like I said, just an idea.

Bryan

[Chris G]

I tried the "Hard" setting for a while but I hated it. Too many artifacts and the effect of sharp outlined heads with "soft" facial features really bothered me. I have been using "STD" but after everything I have read on this camera I think I will turn it off and try RAW for awhile and let Photoshop Elements (yes, I sprung $2400 for the camera but I am really having a hard time spending $600-$700 on software to edit the files) sharpen if needed. Actually, I would like to get an S2 that wouldn't require sharpening for your typical "non-artistic" photos.

[Prime Candidate]

Remember in the old days, when we had to load rolls of film into our cameras, and mostly had to stick to the same film for 36 shots?

Well, we were pretty choosy about what film to use for different conditions and situations - fast/slow, fine grain, coarse grain, good for skin tones, good for greens, good for blues.

Well, I think of all those options on the S2 as just that. I use RAW for 'serious' stuff, when I want ultimate quality. If I'm away from base I'll generally use fine Jpegs so I have plenty of storage, but throw in a RAW shot if it's a very special shot. This afternoon I put some gear on eBay, so I used small Jpegs with Hard sharpening for that, no fiddling, point and shoot and then straight from the camera to eBay.

The beauty of digital means you are not stuck to the same 'film' for 36 shots.

Oh, and we shouldn't be snobbish about using the S2 as a point and shoot, I can imagine there's plenty of people that need this but also need the range of lenses only an SLR can offer.

Tim

[bjnicholls]

Just try to avoid making a quick grab for your camera with unknown settings when you see one of those amazing fleeting shots. You could end up with a disposable camera image instead of real S2 quality. There aren't any low res settings for film.

Having the wealth of settings is wonderful, but it can easily bite you. I've done it to myself — I also use the S2 for down and dirty shooting, but I try to be careful not to accidentally leave the camera in a compromised configuration. With a complex camera it's easy to mess up a single setting that will cause you to lose shots.

One thing the S3 should get is user-programmable camera configuration settings that you can quickly access. My Nikon N70 had a feature like this. It needed it because the controls were so oddball, but it was powerful. I'd make one setting optimized for action shots with continuous focus, shutter priority, etc. Another set the camera into my most preferred aperture priority, single AF mode. With all the possible settings on the S2, a feature like this would be gold.

[S_Leeper]

While I do a mix of jpg, 95%, & raw, 5%, I now use no in-camera sharpening for anything.

While the std sharpening was generally ok, the application of sharpening afterwards, if needed, is one of the few quick things I am willing to do.

One of the big reasons I quit was that when shooting close photos of people the sharpening almost made it look like I had cut & pasted them into the photo...

[Wichita Wayne]

The way I understand it the STD setting is for when you want to print pictures straight out of the camera and avoid post processing. ORG and HARD for sharpening are for pictures that you intend to process with PS or some other post processing software. I am still in the learning stage with my S2 but in my experience this is true. When I know I will use PS then it is ORG-ORG-HARD otherwise it is STD-STD-STD. The camera is so easy to change that it does not make sense not to use different settings for different situations and subjects.

[Joe Peoples]

I shot the same scene with different settings, adjusted each file to achieve the same corrections and presented them to colleagues who knew nothing about which setting was which and "Org" for Tone was the winner. The Color setting is subjective, but I've found that "S" needs the least amount of skintone correction. As far as Sharpening is concerned, I use "S" because Hard Sharpening can produce artifacts or oversharpen certain faces that don't warrant sharpening. I have Photoshop Actions for different type of shoots that I apply in Batch Processing. I've yet to hand over files straight out of the camera for a lab to print, but I'm praying for that day to come soon!